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Thread: What Brand Oil Do you Use? What is Best?

  1. #21
    Senior Member bellwilliam's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Pure EvoIX View Post
    This may very well be true for a 1.8L N/A 136hp 2600lb car. It will not be the same for a 3000lb Turbo'd 450whp boosting 28psi on trac with alot more moving parts. So yes, YMMV.
    so instead of changing oil every 48 track hours. you should be changing how many time more often ?

    okay, how many engines have you gone through in last 3 years ? and how many track hours ?
    Supermiata S1, SuperMiata S2, Supermiata S3
    13 Tesla, ma: no engine !!
    17 GT350 !!
    08 M3 - Carmax warranty !!
    96 NSX
    06 EVO MR
    15 Mini Cooper S

  2. #22
    Track Whore Pure EvoIX's Avatar
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    That is my point...I am paranoid. lol. I change my oil pretty much every 1-1.5 hours of track time aka every 2 events and probably not more than 1000miles.

    I am on my 5th engine.. Every event i probably only do 30-40min of track time if that. I would say my last one lasted 4 track hours if that. In 2012 was my best year. Lasted from end of October 2010 - March of 2012 (2.5yrs). It lasted 2.5 seasons with no major issues. I would say ~40-50 track hours.

    April 2013-Present (3 engines)
    -April 2013 - April 2013 (weekend) (engine rebuild)
    -May 2013 - Oct 2013 (5mo) (new shortblock)
    -Nov 2013 - March 2014 (4mo) (new head)
    -May 2014 - Present

    lol.
    Last edited by Pure EvoIX; 05-12-2014 at 10:47 AM.
    Zhong (Evo IX) | Angry Panda Racing

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  3. #23
    dirty smack talker hakeem's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Pure EvoIX View Post
    This may very well be true for a 1.8L N/A 136hp 2600lb car. It will not be the same for a 3000lb Turbo'd 450whp boosting 28psi on trac with alot more moving parts.
    Why not?

  4. #24
    Track Whore Pure EvoIX's Avatar
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    More heat, more wear, more moving parts.

    How much does a stock miata NB make (120x?). How much do you race with (135?)

    How much does a stock evo make (230whp). How much does my evo make (450whp)
    Zhong (Evo IX) | Angry Panda Racing

    1:53.396 @ BRP CW13 - 11/14/13
    1:47.2xx @ Laguna Seca - 11/28/10
    2:03.026 @ Thill CCW Bypass - 12/20/14
    2:05.100 @ CVR CCW - 1/16/11
    1:58.151 @ CVR CW - 5/5/13
    1:25.56x @ WSIR - 10/13/13
    1:23.128 @ SOW CW - 7/27/14
    1:22.2xx @ SOW CCW - 7/26/14
    1:46.0xx @ ACS Roval - 11/23/14
    1:11.299 @ ACS Infield - 5/18/14

    Fastest Limited/Mod Class Evo in Time Attack at WSIR
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  5. #25
    RaceTape Ninja Force McCocken's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by bellwilliam View Post
    for those of you fancy oil changers that sends oil into Blackstone for oil analysis (I admit I've done it a few times). this is on their FAQ:

    Blackstone Labs

    Q: What's the best oil to use?

    A: Ah, the million dollar question. We are an independent lab, so we don't make recommendations. It has been our experience that oil is oil, and either petroleum or synthetic-based oil will work well for just about any engine.


    Q: Come on, you're holding out on me. I should use synthetic, right?

    A: Buddy, you should use whatever you want. Synthetic oil won't guarantee a longer engine life any more than my eating organic food will guarantee I'll live until I'm 90. We here at Blackstone generally use regular petroleum-based oil because honestly, it works just as well for us.
    Quote Originally Posted by Pure EvoIX View Post
    That is my point...I am paranoid. lol. I change my oil pretty much every 1-1.5 hours of track time aka every 2 events and probably not more than 1000miles.
    I am preferential to Rotella T6 these days. My ancient m20 engine loves it as much as my NA6 and NB Miatas. I can see the usefulness behind the chemistry and physics, but it isn't another aspect I feel I need to obsess over. Zhong, I appreciate your zeal, but out of curiosity, have you fully caged your EVO yet? Not meant as disrespect, I ask out of curiosity and genuine concern for your health and safety versus your engines'.
    Yer pal,
    Force

  6. #26
    Track Whore Pure EvoIX's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Force McCocken View Post
    I am preferential to Rotella T6 these days. My ancient m20 engine loves it as much as my NA6 and NB Miatas. I can see the usefulness behind the chemistry and physics, but it isn't another aspect I feel I need to obsess over. Zhong, I appreciate your zeal, but out of curiosity, have you fully caged your EVO yet? Not meant as disrespect, I ask out of curiosity and genuine concern for your health and safety versus your engines'.
    I am dropping it off less than 2 weeks from now. Soon my friend. Fun fact, I still have all my oem body panels from factory still. I am actually quite surprised how long it has lasted so far. Touch wood x10. Oem front bumper is such a trooper.
    Force McCocken likes this.
    Zhong (Evo IX) | Angry Panda Racing

    1:53.396 @ BRP CW13 - 11/14/13
    1:47.2xx @ Laguna Seca - 11/28/10
    2:03.026 @ Thill CCW Bypass - 12/20/14
    2:05.100 @ CVR CCW - 1/16/11
    1:58.151 @ CVR CW - 5/5/13
    1:25.56x @ WSIR - 10/13/13
    1:23.128 @ SOW CW - 7/27/14
    1:22.2xx @ SOW CCW - 7/26/14
    1:46.0xx @ ACS Roval - 11/23/14
    1:11.299 @ ACS Infield - 5/18/14

    Fastest Limited/Mod Class Evo in Time Attack at WSIR
    2nd Fastest Limited/Mod Class Evo in Time Attack at BRP 13CW

  7. #27
    dirty smack talker hakeem's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Pure EvoIX View Post
    More heat, more wear, more moving parts.

    How much does a stock miata NB make (120x?). How much do you race with (135?)

    How much does a stock evo make (230whp). How much does my evo make (450whp)
    I get that, but what's the relationship between those things you mentioned and how you pick which oil to use? Price?

  8. #28
    Senior Member bellwilliam's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Pure EvoIX View Post
    I am on my 5th engine.. blah blah blah..........
    I apologize if I don't take engine oil advice from someone who gone through 5 engines in 3 years
    hakeem and Red_5 like this.
    Supermiata S1, SuperMiata S2, Supermiata S3
    13 Tesla, ma: no engine !!
    17 GT350 !!
    08 M3 - Carmax warranty !!
    96 NSX
    06 EVO MR
    15 Mini Cooper S

  9. #29
    Track Whore Pure EvoIX's Avatar
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    Hey william, only 52 R888 were used in that so 13 total sets. I think we should be proud that we used 2 sets. Original set we destroyed and they had to replace.
    Zhong (Evo IX) | Angry Panda Racing

    1:53.396 @ BRP CW13 - 11/14/13
    1:47.2xx @ Laguna Seca - 11/28/10
    2:03.026 @ Thill CCW Bypass - 12/20/14
    2:05.100 @ CVR CCW - 1/16/11
    1:58.151 @ CVR CW - 5/5/13
    1:25.56x @ WSIR - 10/13/13
    1:23.128 @ SOW CW - 7/27/14
    1:22.2xx @ SOW CCW - 7/26/14
    1:46.0xx @ ACS Roval - 11/23/14
    1:11.299 @ ACS Infield - 5/18/14

    Fastest Limited/Mod Class Evo in Time Attack at WSIR
    2nd Fastest Limited/Mod Class Evo in Time Attack at BRP 13CW

  10. #30
    Track Whore Pure EvoIX's Avatar
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    Which is why I was asking for advice... -___-
    Zhong (Evo IX) | Angry Panda Racing

    1:53.396 @ BRP CW13 - 11/14/13
    1:47.2xx @ Laguna Seca - 11/28/10
    2:03.026 @ Thill CCW Bypass - 12/20/14
    2:05.100 @ CVR CCW - 1/16/11
    1:58.151 @ CVR CW - 5/5/13
    1:25.56x @ WSIR - 10/13/13
    1:23.128 @ SOW CW - 7/27/14
    1:22.2xx @ SOW CCW - 7/26/14
    1:46.0xx @ ACS Roval - 11/23/14
    1:11.299 @ ACS Infield - 5/18/14

    Fastest Limited/Mod Class Evo in Time Attack at WSIR
    2nd Fastest Limited/Mod Class Evo in Time Attack at BRP 13CW

  11. #31
    Track Whore Pure EvoIX's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by hakeem View Post
    I get that, but what's the relationship between those things you mentioned and how you pick which oil to use? Price?
    I am not asking about how often should i change my oil or whats the cheapest oil out there. I am asking what is the best oil for track use. And if you say any oil is fine as long as you change it often, please explain why and back up what you say.
    I want the oil that i use to do the job well during the time i use it.

    Also keep in mind those videos showing scarring on the bearings. So I want to put something in it that will have minimum scarring. SO no, not any old oil would do so as long as you change it. I want something proven that i can rely on even though I change it often. Get what im trying to achieve?

    I also understand it is one thing to test virgin oil at room temperature vs used oil that has been through 2 track days with high oil/engine temps.
    Last edited by Pure EvoIX; 05-12-2014 at 11:05 AM.
    Zhong (Evo IX) | Angry Panda Racing

    1:53.396 @ BRP CW13 - 11/14/13
    1:47.2xx @ Laguna Seca - 11/28/10
    2:03.026 @ Thill CCW Bypass - 12/20/14
    2:05.100 @ CVR CCW - 1/16/11
    1:58.151 @ CVR CW - 5/5/13
    1:25.56x @ WSIR - 10/13/13
    1:23.128 @ SOW CW - 7/27/14
    1:22.2xx @ SOW CCW - 7/26/14
    1:46.0xx @ ACS Roval - 11/23/14
    1:11.299 @ ACS Infield - 5/18/14

    Fastest Limited/Mod Class Evo in Time Attack at WSIR
    2nd Fastest Limited/Mod Class Evo in Time Attack at BRP 13CW

  12. #32
    Spec Backhoe Champion redtopz's Avatar
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    You can get a wholesale account with Amsoil and they ship bulk in 2 days. The original list does not include the oil I use, which is Amsoil Dominator 10/30 racing oil. First I use their break-in oil on a new engine, then switch to racing oil. Is it necessary? I don't know, but I haven't had any engine problems due to oiling. I also agree that it's a good idea to use the recommended viscosity for your engine and control the oil temps. Don't use high viscosity oil as a bandaid for low pressures/high temps.

    AMSOIL DOMINATOR® 10W-30 Racing Oil
    99 C5 corvette SCCA GT2
    99 Supermiata "Super"

  13. #33
    Track Whore Pure EvoIX's Avatar
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    My engine originally required 10w30 Mobil1.

    i then used Amsoil 10w40 for their zinc and phosphorus when I had my stock factory motor.
    I then used Amsoil 15w50 Dominator, when i had the motor rebuilt.
    Then i moved to 20w50 Royal Purple since its consuming so much oil and I change oil so often anyways.

    I was told to use at least a 15w50 due to the tolerances are much looser than oem factory motor. Also since we live in LA, cold is not much of factor as its probably 65F+ 95% of the year. So the first number is not so important.

    Higher viscosity might take longer to heat up lower oil pressure, at the same time it will be hard to shed the heat as well. It might run a bit rougher on cold starts compared to lower weight (flow faster, higher oil pressure). Having too thin of viscosity and add high heat. If oil can't cope and thins, it won't protect the bearings as well as a higher viscosity oil assuming all things are same.

    Having said that, i still don't know what is best. haha.


    According to AMSOIL
    "Drawbacks of Viscosity Improving additives
    Multi-grade motor oils perform a great service not being too thick at cold startup to prevent engine wear by providing more instantaneous oil flow to critical engine parts. However, there is a draw back. These additives shear back in high heat or during high shear force operation and break down causing some sludging. What's worse is once the additive begins to be depleted the motor oil no long resists thinning so now you have a thinner motor oil at 210 degrees. Your 10W-30 motor oil can easily become a 10W-20 or even a SAE 10 (10W-10) motor oil. I don't have to tell you why that is bad. "


    blah....head hurts...thinking too much. lol.
    Last edited by Pure EvoIX; 05-12-2014 at 11:55 AM.
    Zhong (Evo IX) | Angry Panda Racing

    1:53.396 @ BRP CW13 - 11/14/13
    1:47.2xx @ Laguna Seca - 11/28/10
    2:03.026 @ Thill CCW Bypass - 12/20/14
    2:05.100 @ CVR CCW - 1/16/11
    1:58.151 @ CVR CW - 5/5/13
    1:25.56x @ WSIR - 10/13/13
    1:23.128 @ SOW CW - 7/27/14
    1:22.2xx @ SOW CCW - 7/26/14
    1:46.0xx @ ACS Roval - 11/23/14
    1:11.299 @ ACS Infield - 5/18/14

    Fastest Limited/Mod Class Evo in Time Attack at WSIR
    2nd Fastest Limited/Mod Class Evo in Time Attack at BRP 13CW

  14. #34
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    Quote Originally Posted by Force McCocken View Post
    I am preferential to Rotella T6 these days.
    (fist bump)
    Force McCocken likes this.

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    dirty smack talker hakeem's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by redtopz View Post
    You can get a wholesale account with Amsoil and they ship bulk in 2 days. The original list does not include the oil I use, which is Amsoil Dominator 10/30 racing oil. First I use their break-in oil on a new engine, then switch to racing oil. Is it necessary? I don't know, but I haven't had any engine problems due to oiling. I also agree that it's a good idea to use the recommended viscosity for your engine and control the oil temps. Don't use high viscosity oil as a bandaid for low pressures/high temps.

    AMSOIL DOMINATOR® 10W-30 Racing Oil
    How do you figure out which viscosity is right for your engine? In rotary land 20w50 is the gospel, but how do you know? Is it all temp/pressure related?

    I was reading that Mobil1 Racing 0w50 is supposed to be as good as anything else that is Xw50, but I would hate to find out the hard way.

  16. #36
    Senior Member bellwilliam's Avatar
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    Which oil should I buy for my EVs ?
    Supermiata S1, SuperMiata S2, Supermiata S3
    13 Tesla, ma: no engine !!
    17 GT350 !!
    08 M3 - Carmax warranty !!
    96 NSX
    06 EVO MR
    15 Mini Cooper S

  17. #37
    Track Whore Pure EvoIX's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by bellwilliam View Post
    Which oil should I buy for my EVs ?
    Crystal Gyser or Arrowhead to keep batteries nice and cool. No need to change every 5k, just top off. :P
    Zhong (Evo IX) | Angry Panda Racing

    1:53.396 @ BRP CW13 - 11/14/13
    1:47.2xx @ Laguna Seca - 11/28/10
    2:03.026 @ Thill CCW Bypass - 12/20/14
    2:05.100 @ CVR CCW - 1/16/11
    1:58.151 @ CVR CW - 5/5/13
    1:25.56x @ WSIR - 10/13/13
    1:23.128 @ SOW CW - 7/27/14
    1:22.2xx @ SOW CCW - 7/26/14
    1:46.0xx @ ACS Roval - 11/23/14
    1:11.299 @ ACS Infield - 5/18/14

    Fastest Limited/Mod Class Evo in Time Attack at WSIR
    2nd Fastest Limited/Mod Class Evo in Time Attack at BRP 13CW

  18. #38
    Senior Member Todd R's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Pure EvoIX View Post
    That is my point...I am paranoid. lol. I change my oil pretty much every 1-1.5 hours of track time aka every 2 events and probably not more than 1000miles.

    I am on my 5th engine.. Every event i probably only do 30-40min of track time if that. I would say my last one lasted 4 track hours if that. In 2012 was my best year. Lasted from end of October 2010 - March of 2012 (2.5yrs). It lasted 2.5 seasons with no major issues. I would say ~40-50 track hours.

    April 2013-Present (3 engines)
    -April 2013 - April 2013 (weekend) (engine rebuild)
    -May 2013 - Oct 2013 (5mo) (new shortblock)
    -Nov 2013 - March 2014 (4mo) (new head)
    -May 2014 - Present

    lol.
    I don't think it matters much what automotive oil you use with that rebuild schedule...
    Just curious but can you run a 20 minute session hard without overheating/breaking? What is the weak point on the engine? Oil starvation, detonation, etc?

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    Quote Originally Posted by hakeem View Post
    How do you figure out which viscosity is right for your engine? In rotary land 20w50 is the gospel, but how do you know? Is it all temp/pressure related?

    I was reading that Mobil1 Racing 0w50 is supposed to be as good as anything else that is Xw50, but I would hate to find out the hard way.
    For a factory engine, most owner's manuals have a temperature chart that dictates recommended viscosity. Otherwise it's your engine builders call. For me, if I'm not seeing the good-ole 10psi/1000rpm, >60psi @6,000rpm, at maximum oil temp (maximum ~280F) I'm not happy. I switched to a high pressure oil pump and an oil cooler (which in my mind is still inadequate, I'd like to see 260F max) to get there.
    redtopz likes this.

  20. #40
    BMW Master bawareca's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by bellwilliam View Post
    for those of you fancy oil changers that sends oil into Blackstone for oil analysis (I admit I've done it a few times). this is on their FAQ:

    Blackstone Labs

    Q: What's the best oil to use?

    A: Ah, the million dollar question. We are an independent lab, so we don't make recommendations. It has been our experience that oil is oil, and either petroleum or synthetic-based oil will work well for just about any engine.


    Q: Come on, you're holding out on me. I should use synthetic, right?

    A: Buddy, you should use whatever you want. Synthetic oil won't guarantee a longer engine life any more than my eating organic food will guarantee I'll live until I'm 90. We here at Blackstone generally use regular petroleum-based oil because honestly, it works just as well for us.
    As PureEvo said,it may be Ok for a DD or small engine.Thermal breakdown resistance is what takes the syntetic and mineral oils apart.There are other factors,yes,but this one is the more important for a high-strung or boosted race engine.

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