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Thread: Transitioning from RWD to FWD

  1. #1
    Overcooker F@ck's Avatar
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    Default Transitioning from RWD to FWD

    What am I going to need to do differently in a FWD car?

    I'm doing a LeMons Race in September.

    I've never seen the track and I haven't owned a FWD car since 1990.

    I've got problems. Can you help?

  2. #2
    "Shoe"
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    Few pionts:

    Unlike RWD cars, FWD cars benefit from heavy throttle use when sideways (as long as your front wheels are pointing the correct way)
    FWD understeers more off throttle due to the engines deceleration and diff acting on the front wheels. part throttle often helps reduce the push at corner entry or mid-corner.
    FWD cars are usually set up looser with the rear wanting to rotate a lot more than RWD cars.
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  3. #3
    Senior Member TYP85's Avatar
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    I've ONLY tracked a FWD car, so that's all I know!
    Understeer is all I know!! (kidding)
    You need some rear roll resistance, swaybar, stiffer springs or a combination of both will help reduce understeer.
    Trail braking into a corner will get it rotated up to and a little past the apex, but once you get on the gas hard at apex or a little past, it will start to understeer again.
    Tight turns are usually handled pretty well, I even learned to left foot brake to stay on the brakes longer and then "overlap" with opening the throttle at the same time (hard on the brakes!), this helps keep the "yaw" or attitude later through the corner.
    Long sweepers are a b.i.t.c.h. (like t2 @ willow springs), once you get to the 2nd half of the corner and are trying to turn down to the apex while keeping up your speed, the front just starts to wash out and get mushy.. I either back off to get to the apex, or I run wide, and keep my speed up (I'll need it because it's steep uphill after that turn).
    Toeing out the rear helps alot with turn in and with sweepers, but it makes the rear unstable and twitchy under braking, entry to high speed corners can be very scary, low speed tracks (like the streets of willow), it works much better.
    What car are you planning on running?

    Who needs 4 wheels on the ground??

    may-09-2015-speedventures%25u0025252520-%25252520black%25252520-%25252520turn%2525252013%25252520-%25252520ws2.jpg
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  4. #4
    Master of Disaster SteveLevin's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Stuntman View Post
    FWD understeers more off throttle due to the engines deceleration and diff acting on the front wheels.
    We're talking a Lemons car here...that engine's gonna have less compression than an 8 year old slice of bread and the diff's gonna be more open than a Kardashian.

    Steve
    ucfbrett and SDSUsnowboards like this.

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    RaceTape Ninja Force McCocken's Avatar
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    Drive in reverse.
    Yer pal,
    Force

  6. #6
    Not Certified Slow SDSUsnowboards's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by SteveLevin View Post
    We're talking a Lemons car here...that engine's gonna have less compression than an 8 year old slice of bread and the diff's gonna be more open than a Kardashian.

    Steve
    Eh, the bread joke was stale and jokes about Kardashian have been explored by everyone from every angle.
    SteveLevin and SOneThreeCoupe like this.
    2001 MR2-Eleven
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    Overcooker F@ck's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by TYP85 View Post
    What car are you planning on running?
    It's an 87 CRX with an Integra Swap. I asked the owner if it was vtec yo or not? He said:

    "LS DOHC non-vtec naturally aspirated. Wilwood double pots up front and integra discs in the rear. Koni non adjustable shocks all around. Custom adjustable caster traction bar up front, adjustable camber all around. Stock sway bars front and rear.

    Stage 3 clutch in a 5-speed trams where 1st and second are a little tricky to find.

    Aftermarket headers off a pick-n-pull b16a keep a few pounds off.

    Polycarbonate replaced all the glass."

    Thanks for the advice, everyone. I'm excited for my first W2W race.

  8. #8
    http://www.trackhq.com/Banners/yellowsitesponsor.gif Blackbird's Avatar
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    BS factor sounds real high on that one...

  9. #9
    RaceTape Ninja Force McCocken's Avatar
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    Should be a screamer. I had a few CRXs. When setup right, they corner violently.
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    Yer pal,
    Force

  10. #10
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    I track an 88 CRX, what track are you going to be driving at? I change my set up substantially for each track (much more so than any other car ive owned) CRX has a MEGA short wheel base (8 inches shorter than the civic of the same year.) Because of this Ive found that its more similar to an MR car than a longer wheel base FWD car. Try and carry mid corner speed and minimize trail braking, at least that seems to work for me. If you can, put a 26mm rear bar and a stock HF civic front bar it seems to be the best 'all aronud' set up for CA tracks. Also since you have the Wilwoods up front make sure the radius rod bushing are in good shape or it'll squirm all over the place under braking.
    bawareca likes this.

  11. #11
    Gearhead gixxer_drew's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Stuntman View Post
    Few pionts:

    Unlike RWD cars, FWD cars benefit from heavy throttle use when sideways (as long as your front wheels are pointing the correct way)
    FWD understeers more off throttle due to the engines deceleration and diff acting on the front wheels. part throttle often helps reduce the push at corner entry or mid-corner.
    FWD cars are usually set up looser with the rear wanting to rotate a lot more than RWD cars.
    I would only add to this that the off throttle understeer is dependent on diff which I think you kind of hinted at there.

    I went for taming that out so that throttle control could work out balance any way the driver liked, but really depends on your diff options. On this new gearbox with a clutch type, we will have to deal with that issue again.
    Andrew M Brilliant
    Aerodynamicist / Race Engineer

  12. #12
    "Shoe"
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    Even in an open-diff car or loose 1-way LSD, the front wheels being driven means that in the off throttle coast phase, the torque is acted on the front tires which hurts front grip. But with a diff with more decel lock-up this is even more significant.

  13. #13
    Overcooker F@ck's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by illwillem View Post
    I track an 88 CRX, what track are you going to be driving at?
    Thanks for all the support guys!

    It's the 5-mile Config of Thunderhill.

    Car does not have LSD.

  14. #14
    Kam
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    turn in earlier than you would, and plant your foot into the throttle, giggling the entire way around
    4.6lbs / whp -- 4lbs / bhp

  15. #15
    Senior Member superpilun's Avatar
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    Trail brake all the turns.

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