+ Reply to Thread
Page 1 of 2 1 2 LastLast
Results 1 to 20 of 28
Like Tree13Likes

Thread: Return of the Rotary

  1. #1
    The Real Captain Slow Red_5's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2008
    Location
    Santa Barbara
    Posts
    4,188
    Liked
    704 times

    Default Return of the Rotary

    Seems to be good news for the rotary fans and that includes me.

    Mazda 16X rotary engine two years away, will arrive in all-new model - Autoblog


    We last reported on Mazda's next-generation rotary engine project in June of 2012 when the automaker built its last Renesis-powered RX-8, but rumors of this new engine's development had been around way before that final car left the production line in Japan, last year.

    We now have enthusiastic confirmation that this next-gen rotary engine is really and truly going forward. It is still referred to as 16X and has several priorities. First is to lower fuel consumption compared to the RX-8's engine, while still making gains in terms of performance. The second is to reduce the burning of oil that was happening at the highest revs. And the third and final priority, and perhaps most key for enthusiasts, is to give the powertrain a big torque upgrade.

    What we were told by a Mazda USA insider (while we are all here together at the festivities in Monterey) is that the first application of the new 16X engine will be happening in two years' time in an as yet undisclosed new model. Oh, the mind races to our eternal Mazda wish list...
    How to solve the failings of the Renesis engine that preceded all of this? "The key to both higher torque and better fuel consumption," said the insider, "is creating a longer stroke engine." But we're talking a rotary engine with the fat-triangle rotor and toroidal cam, so how does one determine the way to call this long-stroke or not? "By the path of travel within the combustion space dictated by the engineers," says Mr. Insider.

    What this means for the relative engine capacity and blueprint of the 16X engine is yet to be shown. Longer stroke engines can create greater torque and do so at lower revs. This, it is thought, is what will drastically improve fuel efficiency, emissions, and oil abuse in the 16X.

    This is good news and confirmation for us. Having a Wankel engine in the tech mix makes engine discussion so much more interesting, plus we have always liked the drive experience. Good to know they're not dumping this jewel in the Mazda brand crown.
    Richard EVO and hakeem like this.
    99 Mazda Miata SuperMiata #515 - AKA Sparky SOLD
    '91 Mariner Blue Miata project AKA Napoleon

  2. #2
    BMW Master bawareca's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2011
    Location
    LA
    Posts
    1,711
    Liked
    641 times

    Default

    SkyActiv Wankel Seriosly,where the fun would be of a rotor with a 6 k RPM redline ?(just as an example,but that is what the "fatter torque/lower RPM suggests)
    Mazda sure wants to keep the hype,but this motor may not be suitable for a DD car in 2013 or 2014.If they just manufacture some examples for racing (obviously club or vintage)that would be great.

  3. #3
    Administrator ucfbrett's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2009
    Location
    Ventura, Calif.
    Posts
    5,449
    Liked
    2243 times

    Default

    I'm glad to hear this, but I was hoping for three rotors.

  4. #4
    http://www.trackhq.com/Banners/yellowsitesponsor.gif emilio700's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2007
    Location
    SoCal
    Posts
    3,628
    Liked
    2398 times

    Default

    I predict Mazda wastes their time, talent and money trying to get people to buy rotaries. I love Matsuda but, just let it die a loud annoying, smoky viking death already.
    WWW.949RACING.COM
    SuperMiata

    Aside from their cost I never understood why people race them.
    But obviously I just dont get it. -fatbillybob

  5. #5
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Sep 2011
    Location
    Rolling Hills Estates
    Posts
    2,949
    Liked
    854 times

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by emilio700 View Post
    I predict Mazda wastes their time, talent and money trying to get people to buy rotaries. I love Matsuda but, just let it die a loud annoying, smoky viking death already.

    Hard not to agree. Hope springs eternal, but this horse may be too dead to flail.

  6. #6
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    May 2007
    Posts
    10,979
    Liked
    1477 times

    Default

    Yeah, I guess rotaries went out with spats . . .
    The deposed former Sheriff of trackHQ . . .

    2006 Porsche 997 Carerra Coupe 6-MT - daily driver
    1992 Honda (Acura) NSX 5-MT - classic investment I couldn't resist and occasionally drive
    2004 Honda S2000 AP2 6-MT - track day car
    2006 Mitsubishi Lancer Evolution IX MR 6-MT - when I need a backseat, 4-doors, or a real trunk, and still want to haul ass . . .

  7. #7
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Sep 2011
    Location
    Rolling Hills Estates
    Posts
    2,949
    Liked
    854 times

    Default

    th-1-.jpg

    . . . or disco.
    Last edited by Loose Caboose; 08-16-2013 at 11:03 PM.

  8. #8
    http://www.trackhq.com/Banners/yellowsitesponsor.gif emilio700's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2007
    Location
    SoCal
    Posts
    3,628
    Liked
    2398 times

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Loose Caboose View Post
    Attachment 6046

    . . . or disco.
    Wait, disco is dead?

    damn
    WWW.949RACING.COM
    SuperMiata

    Aside from their cost I never understood why people race them.
    But obviously I just dont get it. -fatbillybob

  9. #9
    The Real Captain Slow Red_5's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2008
    Location
    Santa Barbara
    Posts
    4,188
    Liked
    704 times

    Default

    I still want an RX-8. They probably don't get much worse mileage than my Subaru and I'm sure would be more fun to drive.
    99 Mazda Miata SuperMiata #515 - AKA Sparky SOLD
    '91 Mariner Blue Miata project AKA Napoleon

  10. #10
    Senior Member Johnny_Se7en's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2009
    Location
    The Orange Curtain
    Posts
    1,197
    Liked
    142 times

    Default

    My first two cars were Mazdas, I didn't care about how long the motors lasted. The cars were fun until the motors went.
    If nothing happens and there is no one around why did it not happen?

  11. #11
    http://www.trackhq.com/Banners/yellowsitesponsor.gif Blackbird's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2012
    Location
    Northridge
    Posts
    2,195
    Liked
    1883 times

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Red_5 View Post
    I still want an RX-8. They probably don't get much worse mileage than my Subaru and I'm sure would be more fun to drive.
    I don't know about your Subaru, but RX8s get terrible mileage that is normally reserved For V8 trucks and such, to the tune of 13-15 MPG.

    Honestly, I don't know why Mazda even bothers with it other than trying to please the fanbois.
    The sales of the RX8 were dismal, IIRC they sold 9 of them in the US in the last year of the run.
    The RX8 was a good car despite the gutless engine that was put in it because it had good chassis, steering and brakes... If Mazda had any brains they would have stuffed the 2.3L DISI from the MS3 and had a brilliant car with far better sales.

  12. #12
    dirty smack talker hakeem's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2008
    Location
    San Francisco, CA
    Posts
    3,076
    Liked
    977 times

    Default

    Haters gonna hate

  13. #13
    http://www.trackhq.com/Banners/yellowsitesponsor.gif Blackbird's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2012
    Location
    Northridge
    Posts
    2,195
    Liked
    1883 times

    Default

    C'mon Amir, was there anything said that was not true?
    Did RX8 get excellent mileage and sold well?
    Was the 13B-MSP a good engine paired with a car 3K Lbs. car?
    Did it ever make the claimed power that Mazda talked about originally or did they have to go and heavily revise the ratings and give owners a buy-back option because it wasn't even close?

    It's not hating.
    I think the 13B-MSP can make a good race engine on a light car because it can be revved all day long and the lack of torque is less crucial, but for the RX8 it was just gutless..

    What do you have against disco?

  14. #14
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    May 2007
    Posts
    10,979
    Liked
    1477 times

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Blackbird View Post
    What do you have against disco?
    Disco sucked. In the late 1970s it pretty much killed Rock 'n' Roll until the Grunge era that began around 1990 . . .
    The deposed former Sheriff of trackHQ . . .

    2006 Porsche 997 Carerra Coupe 6-MT - daily driver
    1992 Honda (Acura) NSX 5-MT - classic investment I couldn't resist and occasionally drive
    2004 Honda S2000 AP2 6-MT - track day car
    2006 Mitsubishi Lancer Evolution IX MR 6-MT - when I need a backseat, 4-doors, or a real trunk, and still want to haul ass . . .

  15. #15
    http://www.trackhq.com/Banners/yellowsitesponsor.gif Blackbird's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2012
    Location
    Northridge
    Posts
    2,195
    Liked
    1883 times

    Default

    You must've been asleep for a decade plus, because Appetite for Destruction came out in 87.

  16. #16
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    May 2007
    Posts
    10,979
    Liked
    1477 times

    Default

    I never liked GNR. I bit too derivative of what came before. I saw them as the opening act for the Rolling Stones at the L.A. Colliseum in 1989. Wasn't impressed.

    The Clash was one of the few good rock bands of the 1980s, which was the worst decade for RnR since it's creation in the mid 1950s.
    The deposed former Sheriff of trackHQ . . .

    2006 Porsche 997 Carerra Coupe 6-MT - daily driver
    1992 Honda (Acura) NSX 5-MT - classic investment I couldn't resist and occasionally drive
    2004 Honda S2000 AP2 6-MT - track day car
    2006 Mitsubishi Lancer Evolution IX MR 6-MT - when I need a backseat, 4-doors, or a real trunk, and still want to haul ass . . .

  17. #17
    The Real Captain Slow Red_5's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2008
    Location
    Santa Barbara
    Posts
    4,188
    Liked
    704 times

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Blackbird View Post
    ... If Mazda had any brains they would have stuffed the 2.3L DISI from the MS3 and had a brilliant car with far better sales.
    If, and that's a big IF, I ever bought an RX-8, something like this would be part of the long term plan. 2.5 L Mazda engines are super cheap.
    99 Mazda Miata SuperMiata #515 - AKA Sparky SOLD
    '91 Mariner Blue Miata project AKA Napoleon

  18. #18
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    May 2007
    Posts
    10,979
    Liked
    1477 times

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Red_5 View Post
    If, and that's a big IF, I ever bought an RX-8, something like this would be part of the long term plan. 2.5 L Mazda engines are super cheap.
    Does anybody know if there are any RX-8 to Mazda piston engine conversions out there?

    Believe it or not, a few years back, Tom Dragoun wanted me to convert my 1994 Miata PTE/ITA car to a rotary. I don't think he was kidding, but I guess that's possible . . .
    The deposed former Sheriff of trackHQ . . .

    2006 Porsche 997 Carerra Coupe 6-MT - daily driver
    1992 Honda (Acura) NSX 5-MT - classic investment I couldn't resist and occasionally drive
    2004 Honda S2000 AP2 6-MT - track day car
    2006 Mitsubishi Lancer Evolution IX MR 6-MT - when I need a backseat, 4-doors, or a real trunk, and still want to haul ass . . .

  19. #19
    http://www.trackhq.com/Banners/yellowsitesponsor.gif Blackbird's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2012
    Location
    Northridge
    Posts
    2,195
    Liked
    1883 times

    Default

    That can't be a good advice, Miatas seem to be doing just fine in PTE with their piston engines..
    There are a few rotary Miata running around, most are hack jobs that I wouldn't touch with a 10 ft. pole (this is true to most swaps, nothing to do with it being rotary)... one of them was FS on LA CL for many months, which is never a good sign.

  20. #20
    w00t Nurburgring's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2010
    Location
    Chile
    Posts
    251
    Liked
    111 times

    Default

    The only way it`s getting a big torque bump and lowering consumption at the same time is if it is going to be turbocharged. A that`s highly unlikely, Mazda has been avoiding any kind of forced induction in their new generation engines.

    I agree with let it die already.
    Less powah is better

+ Reply to Thread
Page 1 of 2 1 2 LastLast

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts