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Thread: The next affordable track car(s)? FT 86 / BRZ

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    Default The next affordable track car(s)? FT 86 / BRZ

    First it was the miata, then the s2000, now it seems as though there is a new rwd affordable track car. What do you guys think about their potential?
    Toyota GT 86 makes a compelling case for itself
    2012 Subaru BRZ finally bows

    Cliff notes:
    Strut type front suspension
    Multi-link rear suspension
    Torsen LSD
    200hp 151lb-ft boxer 2.0 liter, 7400rpm redline
    2689lbs curb weight

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    There's also the Scion FR-S, which is probably what the Toyota will be in the USA. It was shown at the L.A. Auto Show, along with the Subaru BRZ concept STi. I don't know if the "concept STi" is the base BRZ, or an uprated model. These cars look great in person. We shall have to wait and see about performance. 13.5 lbs./bhp is not that impressive a weight to power ratio.

    And there's already a forum for these cars: Scion FR-S Forum / FT-86 Forum -- General Topics - Scion FR-S Forum | Subaru BRZ Forum | Toyota 86 Forum | ft86club
    Last edited by Richard EVO; 11-30-2011 at 01:53 PM.
    The deposed former Sheriff of trackHQ . . .

    2006 Porsche 997 Carerra Coupe 6-MT - daily driver
    1992 Honda (Acura) NSX 5-MT - classic investment I couldn't resist and occasionally drive
    2004 Honda S2000 AP2 6-MT - track day car
    2006 Mitsubishi Lancer Evolution IX MR 6-MT - when I need a backseat, 4-doors, or a real trunk, and still want to haul ass . . .

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    The Real Captain Slow Red_5's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Richard EVO View Post
    There's also the Scion FR-S, which is probably what the Toyota will be in the USA. It was shown at the L.A. Auto Show, along with the Subaru BRZ concept STi. I don't know if the "concept STi" is the base BRZ, or an uprated model. These cars look great in person. We shall have to wait and see about performance. 13.5 lbs./bhp is not that impressive a weight to power ratio.

    And there's already a forum for these cars: Scion FR-S Forum / FT-86 Forum -- General Topics - Scion FR-S Forum | Subaru BRZ Forum | Toyota 86 Forum | ft86club
    Isn't that a better weight to power ratio than an S2K? Weighs less and Im sure has an easy 150+ pounds to remove. I think it looks promising and I'm excited for them but I'll stick with Mazda as long as Mazdaspeed Motorsports is around.
    99 Mazda Miata SuperMiata #515 - AKA Sparky SOLD
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    Quote Originally Posted by Red_5 View Post
    Isn't that a better weight to power ratio than an S2K?
    No. S2000 is 2835 lbs./240 bhp = 11.8 weight to power ratio. And it has a VTEC engine that revs to 9000 rpm (2000 - 2003 AP1 models).
    The deposed former Sheriff of trackHQ . . .

    2006 Porsche 997 Carerra Coupe 6-MT - daily driver
    1992 Honda (Acura) NSX 5-MT - classic investment I couldn't resist and occasionally drive
    2004 Honda S2000 AP2 6-MT - track day car
    2006 Mitsubishi Lancer Evolution IX MR 6-MT - when I need a backseat, 4-doors, or a real trunk, and still want to haul ass . . .

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    Senior Member zjchaser's Avatar
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    I VERY seriously considering one for a DD...just waiting on pricing and when they will actually be available.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Richard EVO View Post
    No. S2000 is 2835 lbs./240 bhp = 11.8 weight to power ratio. And it has a VTEC engine that revs to 9000 rpm (2000 - 2003 AP1 models).
    I know what I wrote was blasphemy but this car will cost roughly $10k less than than an S2k cost 10 years ago. Your S2k is probably your least expensive car when purchased new. And by the way, you can't go to the Honda dealership and buy something rear wheel drive that's new.
    99 Mazda Miata SuperMiata #515 - AKA Sparky SOLD
    '91 Mariner Blue Miata project AKA Napoleon

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    ^^^I guess you are right about the prices. An S2K cost $32,600 new in 2003 according to cars.com. IIRC, the Evo IX MR was about $34,000 in 2006. The NSX was $65,000 in 1992 based on the original window sticker that came with it, and the Jaguar Vanden Plas (you didn't know about that one) was $68,330 in 2002 according to cars.com. The only one I actually bought new was the Evo.

    It's sad but true that Honda (and a number of other car manufacturers) have gone away from rwd, as the green/hybrid scourage continues to snowball.
    Last edited by Richard EVO; 11-30-2011 at 02:53 PM.
    The deposed former Sheriff of trackHQ . . .

    2006 Porsche 997 Carerra Coupe 6-MT - daily driver
    1992 Honda (Acura) NSX 5-MT - classic investment I couldn't resist and occasionally drive
    2004 Honda S2000 AP2 6-MT - track day car
    2006 Mitsubishi Lancer Evolution IX MR 6-MT - when I need a backseat, 4-doors, or a real trunk, and still want to haul ass . . .

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    Quote Originally Posted by Richard EVO View Post
    ^^^I guess you are right about the prices. An S2K cost $32,600 new in 2003 according to cars.com. IIRC, the Evo IX MR was about $34,000 in 2006. The NSX was $65,000 in 1992 based on the original window sticker that came with it, and the Jaguar Vanden Plas (you didn't know about that one) was $68,330 in 2002 according to cars.com. The only one I actually bought new was the Evo.

    It's sad but true that Honda (and a number of other car manufacturers) have gone away from rwd, as the green/hybrid scourage continues to snowball.

    That's if you could get one for sticker. I remember an S2000 in the showroom when they first came out. $40,000 addendum to the Monroney for the "value added." Because Toyota and Subaru are offering essentially the same model, I think there will less chance for price-gouging.

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    Senior Member Silversprint's Avatar
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    If you only they sold some of these parts with it.

    03-subaru-brz-gt300-live.jpg
    mlk_f1 likes this.
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    you can get those, usually a cool million and you need to sign an agreement to campaign it since they are probably loosing money at that price.
    bawareca likes this.
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    Smack-Talkin' Member J. Tyler's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ucfbrett View Post
    That's if you could get one for sticker. I remember an S2000 in the showroom when they first came out. $40,000 addendum to the Monroney for the "value added." Because Toyota and Subaru are offering essentially the same model, I think there will less chance for price-gouging.
    If it is going to be branded a Scion in the US, the sticker price is the price you pay. That is Scion's policy; no negotiating. The upside is, dealers can't try to mark them up.

    Also, there is not a huge market for cars like this. I doubt dealers will try to charge over sticker, but if they do, just wait a few months for supply to build up and then they will be discounted.

    $.02

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    More on the SuperGT car: I find the lack of front and rear overhang really interesting the general look and feel probably wont change a lot so I expect thats as final. The boxer engine setup grants them some room to work with up front though, it better be good since it looks like the left the engine up front. Usually trying to hit testing in late winter its interesting its revealed this early.
    Andrew M Brilliant
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    Quote Originally Posted by gixxer_drew View Post
    More on the SuperGT car: I find the lack of front and rear overhang really interesting the general look and feel probably wont change a lot so I expect thats as final. The boxer engine setup grants them some room to work with up front though, it better be good since it looks like the left the engine up front. Usually trying to hit testing in late winter its interesting its revealed this early.
    Any specs on the SuperGT boxer engine? So they didn't stick this engine in the middle huh?

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    I'm thinking this could make a great DD especially if the price is around 25k for a nicely optioned one...

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    Check this out, scroll down to see the TRD track package.

    Scion FR-S Forum / Subaru BRZ Forum / Toyota 86 Forum and Blog — FT86club.com*2012 2013 Scion FR-S Subaru BRZ Toyota 86 Wallpaper, Photo, Video, News, Blog and Forum

    "These look to be complete track spec cars complete with full rollcage, lightweight racing wheels, and huge wing spoiler (on one of the models)."
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    Pro Lurker GreyFocus's Avatar
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    those pictures of the motor/front suspension looks shockingly similar to subaru pieces(strut design, LCAs, etc). Hopefully it doesnt have the same subaru inherent understeer characteristic.

    also does anyone know what the stock wheel width/tire sizes are? im concerned the car is not going to be able to fit big rubber, which was a welcome feature of the S2k chassis

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    Stock rubber is 215/45/17 from what I remember.

    I really hope 255's will fit. I wonder if the car will fit 4 255's. It would be really short sighted of them to design the car to hold 4 stock size tires only.

    Brakes look small. Will this have the same brake problem s2ks have?

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    Gearhead gixxer_drew's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by WLopez34 View Post
    Any specs on the SuperGT boxer engine? So they didn't stick this engine in the middle huh?
    I need to find out more, that was the first I saw of that car as well. Looks like the retained the forward engine and IMO thats a serious compromise within the rules but it depends on how they decide to equalize this year.

    how do you have a "manufacturer est" drag Cd??? Not tested???
    Last edited by gixxer_drew; 12-01-2011 at 02:13 AM.
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    Senior Member WLopez34's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by gixxer_drew View Post
    I need to find out more, that was the first I saw of that car as well. Looks like the retained the forward engine and IMO thats a serious compromise within the rules but it depends on how they decide to equalize this year.



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