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Thread: How to point by video

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    Senior Member bellwilliam's Avatar
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    Default How to point by video

    just got this e-mail from Aaron B. with it, he included a point-by video by Michael Tsay

    "If you are in this group (red) you are expected to follow Speed Ventures etiquette and protocol. (If you don't we'll kick you out!) All of you have driven with us before, so you already know that this means: A). no race passes, no stealing apexes, no aggressive race driving and B). letting people by who turn faster laptimes IMMEDIATELY without delay. "B" is actually more important than "A" in a certain sense because a lack of "B" leads to "A".

    To be clear: if someone is faster, let them by immediately by lifting off the gas. If you have a higher horsepower car than the quicker (in terms of laptimes) car behind you, lift off the gas to let them by.

    Anyone who does not follow "B" and "A" above will be moved down to the BLACK group until you can demonstrate awareness of other cars and courtesy pointing by immediately, as well as safe driving.

    Mike Tsay produced the following "Point-By Public Service Announcement" for your viewing pleasure. Although this video shows courtesy and etiquette in the BLACK group, everything in it still applies to the RED group!!

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JU6fF4xjmSc "
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    Driver upgrade 2.51 JC3D's Avatar
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    I got the same email, that means I'll see you on the track at 8am.
    John
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    Master of Disaster SteveLevin's Avatar
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    I'll be the cynic and say that the first point-by was somewhat crappy (the guy got out of the throttle too early and the camera car almost caught him up), and the second was incredibly crappy (forcing the passer into a totally suckful line that killed his speed anyway. Only the last one was decent.

    Steve "Grumpy" Levin

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    Track Newbie NammyBoy's Avatar
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    I'm registered to run in red group this Sunday, but I didn't get any e-mail like that. It's probably because I've had plenty of practice pointing people by. I think it was Dave Lach who said to me earlier this year when I was running in blue group, "isn't your arm tired of pointing people by?"

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    What's Traction Control? 600RR_Rocket's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by SteveLevin View Post
    I'll be the cynic and say that the first point-by was somewhat crappy (the guy got out of the throttle too early and the camera car almost caught him up), and the second was incredibly crappy (forcing the passer into a totally suckful line that killed his speed anyway. Only the last one was decent.

    Steve "Grumpy" Levin
    Regarding your second point, shouldn't the passee stay on-line and the passor off-line?

    What the hell?? A "Courtesy Brake"? That could be potentially dangerous. I remember Manly a while back posting a video of a Ferrari giving him a "courtesy brake" and a collision almost occurred had it not been for Manly's cat-like reflexes.

    I didn't get an email? Maybe it was only sent to those that have been targeted for prior complaints.

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    Track Newbie NammyBoy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by 600RR_Rocket View Post
    What the hell?? A "Courtesy Brake"? That could be potentially dangerous.
    I do a courtesy brake sometimes. For example, if someone catches up to me in the esses at Buttonwillow, I give him the point-by at the exit of the esses and since I'm already carrying so much speed, I do a courtesy brake as he is to my side (not when he's behind me) so that he can get past, get back to the right side of the track to initiate his turn-in for Sunset. I don't know about courtesy braking when someone is behind you though...

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    What's Traction Control? 600RR_Rocket's Avatar
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    Yeah, SV should definitely pull that second clip in the video. People might be encouraged to think that "brake checking" is okay. If someone is gaining on you, a simple lift off the throttle should be sufficient to let someone by. Nam, in your case, a throttle lift after the esses should give more than enough time for someone to get back online for Sunset. If not, wait until the front straight to let him by.

    Funny that Aaron Bitterman blessed that video. I could swear that during the morning drivers meeting that says to lift off the throttle and not to brake check...

    Here's Manly's video I referenced earlier. A prime example why "brake checking" while pointing-by is NOT a good idea:

    Last edited by 600RR_Rocket; 07-31-2009 at 12:54 PM.

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    Track Newbie NammyBoy's Avatar
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    Situation: you give the point-by, you lift your throttle, and the NA Miata on slicks that is now aside you can barely get ahead of you. The apex of the corner is fast approaching, and at this rate it almost looks like he's stealing your apex. Contrast that with Corvettes, I give them the point by, and keep the throttle planted.

    Wow, that Manly vid looks horrible! Like I said, I would only apply brakes when the other car is beside, not behind, me.

    Were point-by's always required in red group? I thought that if the other driver is clearly slowing down or moving out of the way, you can pass without the point-by...
    Last edited by NammyBoy; 07-31-2009 at 01:02 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by NammyBoy View Post
    I'm registered to run in red group this Sunday, but I didn't get any e-mail like that. It's probably because I've had plenty of practice pointing people by. I think it was Dave Lach who said to me earlier this year when I was running in blue group, "isn't your arm tired of pointing people by?"
    I guarantee you that nobody at SpeedVentures decided which drivers to send that email by whether or not they give point bys. If you didn't get it, that's a pretty good sign you are not registered in Red group.
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    Senior Member bellwilliam's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by NammyBoy View Post
    Were point-by's always required in red group? I thought that if the other driver is clearly slowing down or moving out of the way, you can pass without the point-by...
    not required. I don't expect a point by when I pass. that video was for intermediate group, as Aaron pointed out. point by is more of a courtesy, sometime overtaker don't know which side you prefer.
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    Master of Disaster SteveLevin's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by 600RR_Rocket View Post
    Regarding your second point, shouldn't the passee stay on-line and the passor off-line?
    Absolutely, but what I saw there was the passee really slowing up so late that the passor was left with an awkward position. Not unsafe, just not very fast...the faster way would have been for the Lotus to romp through 10 and then stay to the left at the exit and let the pass happy (then slide in right behind to set up for 11. The net lap times for both cars would have been better.

    Steve

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    This much talk about how to give a point by in Red Group (that is who the email with the video was sent to) is like telling a rocket scientist to always remember that 2 + 2 = 4. Two plus two equals four. II + II = IV. Now how much is two plus two?
    The deposed former Sheriff of trackHQ . . .

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    This reminds me of Jakus karate chopping video:

    [YOUTUBE]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C5e_bqEo8pc&eurl=http%3A%2F%2Fww w.trackhq.com%2Fforums%2Fshowthread.php% 3Fp%3D17351&feature=player_embedded[/YOUTUBE]
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    Jaku has me to thank for finally getting around the bozo in the Mustang.
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    Senior Member bellwilliam's Avatar
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    it sounds to me like a few didn't get the e-mail. first part is important:

    "The RED group will go out on track at 8am and all RED group drivers have permission to miss the drivers meeting at 7:50am. You are all very lucky that you don't have to listen to me at 8am, but with this privilege comes great responsibility!

    1.
    If you don't check in and get your wristband by 7:40am you will miss your 8am session. I suggest you get to registration 7:00 to 7:30 in case there is a line. Half of my RED group drivers like to saunter in at 7:50am, but this won't work for tomorrow. We will be in the Drivers Meeting, not at registration, if you show up after 7:45. And then you'll miss your first session."
    Last edited by bellwilliam; 07-31-2009 at 04:30 PM.
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    What's Traction Control? 600RR_Rocket's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Richard EVO View Post
    This much talk about how to give a point by in Red Group (that is who the email with the video was sent to) is like telling a rocket scientist to always remember that 2 + 2 = 4. Two plus two equals four. II + II = IV. Now how much is two plus two?
    Not all people on this forum are HPDE warrior veterans such as yourself. Continuing to hammer home the point (especially when bad habits continually occur) can only provide benefit.

  18. #18
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    Ed, if you see Aaron tomorrow, can you tell him I am down for working at Laguna Seca, and that I don't really want to drive all that much. So I will have more than enough time to instruct. Have him email me or give me his phone number or email address, his voicemail cut out and I couldn't hear his phone number that well.

    Also let him know I'm in Australia right now and ill call him late this week when I get back.

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    What's Traction Control? 600RR_Rocket's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Stuntman View Post
    Ed, if you see Aaron tomorrow, can you tell him I am down for working at Laguna Seca, and that I don't really want to drive all that much. So I will have more than enough time to instruct. Have him email me or give me his phone number or email address, his voicemail cut out and I couldn't hear his phone number that well.

    Also let him know I'm in Australia right now and ill call him late this week when I get back.
    PM Sent.

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