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Thread: How do Indy Cars compare to F1 Cars?

  1. #1
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    Default How do Indy Cars compare to F1 Cars?

    I was just watching the IndyCar race on the street circuit in Detroit on TV. How do these cars compare to the F1 cars regarding technology, development, cost, and overall speed and handling? One obvious difference is that the IndyCars can refuel during the race, but F1 cars must run the whole race with the fuel they start with. F1 cars now have 1.6 liter V6 Turbo engines supplied by Mercedes, Renault, or Ferrari, and they have DRS, and KERS. IndyCars have 2.2 liter V6 (single or double) Turbo engines supplied by Honda, Chevy, or Lotus, and something called "push to pass." Both series require the drivers to use two different tire compounds during the race.

    F1 cars drive only road courses. Indy Cars run a mix of ovals and road courses. The fastest Indy Cars were running 223 mph laps on the Indianapolis Motor Speedway oval last week. F1 cars never go that fast, but then they don't run ovals.

    That's about all I know about the differences between these cars. Can the more knowledgeable of you please enlighten me? Thanks.
    Last edited by Richard EVO; 05-31-2014 at 10:19 PM.
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    Senior Member pucsicsal's Avatar
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    The F1 car is greater in every criteria you mentioned.

  3. #3
    Sir flink
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    It all looks the same from the outside, but only one of those classes sounds like a wet fart.

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    I was asking for knowledgeable information, not ignorant BS . . .
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    The deposed former Sheriff of trackHQ . . .

    2006 Porsche 997 Carerra Coupe 6-MT - daily driver
    1992 Honda (Acura) NSX 5-MT - classic investment I couldn't resist and occasionally drive
    2004 Honda S2000 AP2 6-MT - track day car
    2006 Mitsubishi Lancer Evolution IX MR 6-MT - when I need a backseat, 4-doors, or a real trunk, and still want to haul ass . . .

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    BMW Master bawareca's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Richard EVO View Post
    I was asking for knowledgeable information, not ignorant BS . . .
    At least a few years ago,Indy would have been a bit faster on oval and a few seconds slower on a road course,compared to F1 car.Couple of tens of millions extra for a few seconds may be well worth or not a t all depending on the point of view

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    Check out this link to Machine Design magazine for a rough numbers comparison: 2014 Indy 500: A year of transition | Automotive content from Machine Design

    F! has less weight by over 100 pounds and more hp-depending on boost. Tires, suspension technology are all better too on F1, but that is what mega $ provides. This years MD article (and many of last few years) is a little disappointing but still worth looking at.

    Bob

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    The formula 1 cars used to sound better.
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    Quote Originally Posted by DutchOven View Post
    The formula 1 cars used to sound better.
    And Indy cars too This thing has a reworked Judd IRL engine coupled to F1 semiauto tranny (Richard FF to 2:00) :

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    Gearhead gixxer_drew's Avatar
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    orders of magnitude on budget and no competition. What do you expect?
    Andrew M Brilliant
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    Master of Disaster SteveLevin's Avatar
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    Indycars are, by definition, a lot more robust since the ovals are fairly unforgiving on impact. Not to mention the street courses -- I think it was Justin Wilson who recently commented that F1 cars don't take anywhere near the pounding the Indycars get at Long Beach (and having seen Detroit, I can't only think that would be worse).

    The budgets are, of course, much smaller -- I would guess that just the Marussia and Caterham budgets combined would represent more than half the Indycar field. The cars are spec aside from the engines, although there has been ongoing talk of allowing a few different bodywork packages (balanced against the concern that just one team would end up with a killer package and then run away from the field).

    I do miss the wild early 1990s when CART had all kinds of packages that blasted around the track, but the truth is that in the end it priced itself out of business. Certainly Tony George and the IRL helped, but the truth is that CART had put itself into the middle of a pool of gasoline and Tony George merely lit a match.

    Steve
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    Quote Originally Posted by bawareca View Post
    And Indy cars too This thing has a reworked Judd IRL engine coupled to F1 semiauto tranny (Richard FF to 2:00) :

    This is why some people use the word "scream" - as in banshees or hellhounds - to describe the way some very serious cars sound.

    th-3.jpg th.jpg
    Last edited by Loose Caboose; 06-01-2014 at 09:42 PM.
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    More seriously, the biggest difference is that all teams must use the same Dallara rolling chassis and the same (McLaren) ECU.

    The chassis "only" costs $345,000 - or about 8 times the cost one F1 steering wheel. ( Feature: The steering wheel )

    See the wiki excerpt below - or the link: IndyCar Series - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
    . . . . .
    On July 14, 2010, the series announced that Dallara had been chosen over four other bids to replace the current Dallara chassis in 2012.[25][26]

    Dallara will provide a rolling chassis that will serve as the base of the car. Teams will choose an aero kit (sidepods, engine covers, front/rear wings) built by any manufacturer (including the teams themselves) to complete the chassis. Aero kits . . . . will have a maximum price of $70,000. Cars will be badged based on their aero kit manufacturers and not the chassis manufacturer. The Dallara name will not be a part of the car's name (e.g. if Team Penske produces their own aero kit, they will drive a "Penske IndyCar", not a "Penske Dallara"). A team will not be able to run more than 2 aero kits in a season.

    . . . .Dallara's rolling chassis will be sold to teams for $345,000 each. . . .

    The new open engine formula will use 2.2 liter twin-turbocharged V6 Engines . . . to produce the full range of 550750 HP. The formula would allow hybrid systems, KERS system similar to Formula 1, and other engine enhancements. The "push to pass" feature in 2012 will allow a limited horsepower gain up to 100 HP . . . . .

    And a very nice recent development:
    On October 19, 2011, the IndyCar Series announced that the new Dallara chassis would be named in honor of Dan Wheldon, who did much of the testing for the new chassis prior to his death.
    [27]
    Last edited by Loose Caboose; 06-01-2014 at 09:48 PM.

  13. #13
    Gearhead gixxer_drew's Avatar
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    Let me just say the downforce on the kits will not even be massive leaps in performance over what it was originally from Dallara. This is to me probably the most significant thing to happen to IndyCar in a while in terms of performance. I am very much looking forward to it, to the point it crossed my mind to move back to the US and live in a place like North Carolina.
    Andrew M Brilliant
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    This was a pretty neat chart.

    screen-shot-2014-06-02-8.32.54-am.png

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    The chart is old and has the F1 details of yesteryear.
    Current models have a 1.6L turbo V6 hybrid mated to an 8 speed trans.

    IIRC, during the V8 years some of the engines were knocking on the door of mid-800s in terms of HP.

    The indy body work makes even the current crop of F1 look fabulous.
    Last edited by Blackbird; 06-02-2014 at 08:57 AM.
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    Note that, in addition to the Indy cars Dallara also produces a spec chassis for the 1,290 lb. GP2 cars, which also all have the same 600 hp Renault motor.

    A nice Indy, F1, GP2 comparison:



    Formula One vs IRL vs GP2 - F1technical.net

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    I dont know about the current chassis but when I worked in indycar the top speeds were quite a bit quicker than 230mph
    Andrew M Brilliant
    Aerodynamicist / Race Engineer

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    Master of Disaster SteveLevin's Avatar
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    I want to say that the telemetry they had on TV showed top speeds of 236 down the straights and 225 in the corners, but that could be off 1-2mph for the fastest laps. I think only 4 years have featured cars running 4 lap averages over 230, with one of those years being in a Buick/Menard stockblocker (and thus sort of fast but oddball) and another year (1996) being the crazy stupid IRL year where they allowed the previous year's ruleset without changes which meant people brought totally sorted (and thus even faster) packages to the Speedway.

    RIP, Scotty Brayton.

    Steve

  19. #19
    http://www.trackhq.com/Banners/yellowsitesponsor.gif Blackbird's Avatar
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    The closest comparison on same track I could think of isn't close at all, because the cars are completely different.
    But, here's a link to track records at Montreal -

    Circuit Gilles Villeneuve - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

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