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Thread: Does this blog make sense to you?

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    Administrator ucfbrett's Avatar
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    Not Certified Slow SDSUsnowboards's Avatar
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    No, it doesn't. It highlights the error in the common perception that victims have special insights the rest of us do not have. They do not. They have a lop-sided emotional perspective of the issue.

    I agree with many of his points (regulation is bad), but he contradicts himself, especially by admitting that he would continue to use the devices that he blames for his burns.

    Unfortunately, the notion of personal responsibility is directly opposed to the present state of tort law, where everyone is responsible for everyone else, but not themselves. We must change the law before we change our attitude about personal responsibility.
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    Administrator ucfbrett's Avatar
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    Yep. I just had lunch with Red_5 and he pointed out how ironic it was that the writer made no mention of the Nomex suit, gloves, underwear, socks and racing shoes that prevented his burns from being more severe than they were.

    Those were required, too, but I guess those were OK because, well, he was on fire. His point would be roughly the same as someone who rails against fire suits because you don't need them in a crash. Also, if you read the first blog post about what happened, he said he was sprayed with fuel on his arm and leg. How does raw fuel enter the passenger compartment? How does such a car pass tech?

    Rules and regulations have been around since the second person walked the earth. Sometimes they're necessary whether it's convenient or not. In racing, rules regarding safety equipment exist for one of two reasons: A) someone has been killed before and a required piece of safety equipment will save help lives. A HANS comes to mind real fast; and B) someone has been hurt before and a required piece of equipment will help prevent injury.

    The most galling part about it, as SDSUSnowboards points out, is that he said he'd continue to use the safety equipment he rails against in his blog which renders his point moot.

    The blog post should have been titled, "Why it's important to practice fast escapes."

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    Senior Member robburgoon's Avatar
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    Shorter version "People keep coming up to me about what new safety rules we should add because I got burned and it pisses me off"


    Still a fan of tee shirt spec miata.

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    Chest hair required Olitho's Avatar
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    He does not mention his fire system and why it did or did not work. Did he have the minimalist 5 lb hand held or did he have two systems like I have in my car, one halon and one foam. The halon triggers without my input at 155 degrees and the foam goes off at 185 degrees.
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    Senior Member robburgoon's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Olitho View Post
    He does not mention his fire system and why it did or did not work. Did he have the minimalist 5 lb hand held or did he have two systems like I have in my car, one halon and one foam. The halon triggers without my input at 155 degrees and the foam goes off at 185 degrees.
    Sounded to me like he had a fire supression system that he triggered but was largely ineffective with the size of the fire he was facing.

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    AROSC Comp. Director Slaysman's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by robburgoon View Post
    Sounded to me like he had a fire supression system that he triggered but was largely ineffective with the size of the fire he was facing.
    In another episode, he says he intentionally did not activate the fire system. He thought the fire was too intense, and didn't want to waste a second or two when he main objective was to get out of the car.

    We do a drill at our race school of timing all the racers to see how fast they ca get out of their car. Then we repeat it with the driver blindfolded. I learned something about my new latch link harnesses - they don't come apart fully when I release them. The lap belt tang cocks in the slots in the shoulder harness and anti-sub strap pieces, and traps one of my legs. I physically have to unlatch the belts, then pull the lap belts apart. Going to get a cam lock setup before the next race.

    I dodged a bullet at a Chump Car race. Came in for fuel and a driver change, and the other guy went out and made about 3 corners when a fireball erupted in the cockpit. He had trouble with the door, and had to climb across the transmission tunnel and out the window. He had a couple of small holes burned in the back of his suit, but nothing serious. Bad fuel cell installation combined with cap installed wrong resulted in fuel slosh onto the exhaust system.

    I might not have faired so well. We never practiced emergency egress. I never latched or unlatched the belts, never opened the door, never removed the window net. This was always done by team members in the pits getting me in or out of the car. The door handle was stock, and on the 240Z it is down low on the door, nicely wedged between the NASCAR bars (no pull cord or wire was installed), and I doubt I would have known where it was. Probably why the other guy gave up on getting the driver door opened.

    Back to the original post, I am not sure where he is going with this blog. Maybe trying to maximize his 15 minutes of "fame"?
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    Chest hair required Olitho's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Slaysman View Post
    In another episode, he says he intentionally did not activate the fire system. He thought the fire was too intense, and didn't want to waste a second or two when he main objective was to get out of the car.
    This is another reason whey I have two systems, both can be activated manually or activated automatically at high cabin temperatures.
    To the right of The Sheriff. Isn't everyone?

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    The Real Captain Slow Red_5's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Slaysman View Post
    In another episode, he says he intentionally did not activate the fire system. He thought the fire was too intense, and didn't want to waste a second or two when he main objective was to get out of the car.
    Does this make sense to anyone? It should only take a split second to pull fire suppression knob. Even if the fire is too big to put out, I would think the suppression should knock the fire down some hopefully giving a cooler exit. I've never been in this situation, hope to never be and I hate to Monday morning quarterback this guy but I just don't understand that thinking. I am open to explanations though.
    99 Mazda Miata SuperMiata #515 - AKA Sparky SOLD
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    No. He's arguing based on anecdotal fallacy. The entirety of his argument's sample size is tied-up in a very narrow band of experience.

    He doesn't credit the items that actually helped in the situation -- nomex gloves, suit, underwear, balaclava. And somehow argues that since the other items that could save his life in many situations -- roll cage, window net, arm restraint, HANS, harness, helmet, etc... are somehow unnecessary because he didn't need them in THAT situation.

    It's such a strange way to think about things.

    You don't mitigate overall risk by removing insurances (window net) for "event A" (rollover or debris flying) just because those insurances might hinder you in "event B" (fire). That's just dumb. You mitigate risk by practicing ways to make sure that the insurances for "event A" hinder you less in "event B" (practicing vehicle escape)

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    Not Certified Slow SDSUsnowboards's Avatar
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    I've always figured the MR format was less risky in regards to a sudden engine bay fire.

    The fire would be behind the driver. As the car moved forward, the heat radiation and flame propagation will be behind the driver, and directed towards the rear of the car. Once stationary, the benefits of MR cease in a fire scenario except to the extent that the flame and smoke will initially be only behind the driver, for what that's worth.

    Does this sound about right?

    Now that I'm driving a MR2-Eleven, with no top, egress should be easy and quick, unless the car is upside down. Then it will be hellish. Can't practice for that.
    2001 MR2-Eleven
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    Or you could just race karts. Then you'll just be thrown clear of the wreckage (no harness)

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