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Thread: Best story of the year : VW / Audi TDI tricks emission test

  1. #21
    BMW Master bawareca's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by b3d3g1 View Post
    I don't think it's that simple anymore. I'm guessing only a dealer will be able to pair a new stock ECU to a car because of the immobilizer.
    Or call me

  2. #22
    Senior Member Silversprint's Avatar
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    The big question is how will the emission legal software affect mpg, deliverability, and reliability. There will be a lot of pissed off people if these car end up getting 25mpg after the emissions fix.

    VW engineers aren't dumb. They knew what they were doing. They did this for a reason.
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    Senior Member bellwilliam's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Silversprint View Post

    VW engineers aren't dumb. They knew what they were doing. They did this for a reason.
    Reason is simple. Some big wig said (German accent) "you make it pass smog while getting 45mpg, or you are gonna be working at Skoda group". TDI passed with flying color, tech got promoted to Audi LeMan team (in 2009, Peugeot beats Audi at LeMan), and won 5 straight LeMan for Audi
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    Senior Member bellwilliam's Avatar
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    There is cheating, and there is CHEATING.
    EPA and CARB are gonna hurt VW / Audi really bad. No way they are getting off lightly.

    Other than fine, I doubt EPA will be satisfied with a simple ecu reprogram recall.
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    Senior Member bellwilliam's Avatar
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    how VW got caught:

    Curious clean-air group discovered VW emissions violations

    German and his group were actually trying to prove exactly what Volkswagen has been claiming for years: that diesel is clean.

    They asked West Virginia University for help. The school’s Center for Alternative Fuels, Engines and Emissions had the right equipment -- a portable emission measurement system to stick in the car trunk, attached to a probe to shove up the exhaust pipe.

    Then German received the results of the real-world tests.

    “We were astounded when we saw the numbers,” he said.

    On the open road, the Jetta exceeded the U.S. nitrogen oxide emissions standard by 15 to 35 times. The Passat was 5 to 20 times the standard.

    .
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  6. #26
    Senior Member bellwilliam's Avatar
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    By early afternoon trading in Frankfurt, Volkswagen’s share price was down a stunning 19.4 percent at near three-year low of 130.20 euros

    this might not be over yet. may be European and/or Asian TDI had the same thing ?
    how about other manufacturers ? how about gas engine cars ? from VW and all others ?
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    Senior Member robburgoon's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by bellwilliam View Post
    By early afternoon trading in Frankfurt, Volkswagen’s share price was down a stunning 19.4 percent at near three-year low of 130.20 euros

    this might not be over yet. may be European and/or Asian TDI had the same thing ?
    how about other manufacturers ? how about gas engine cars ? from VW and all others ?
    Better question: Why didn't Fiat or BMW figure out what Audi was up to? Don't they buy each other's cars to figure out how they are doing what they are doing? (and if they are cheating?)

    Conspiracy theory: German tipped off by Germans?

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    BMW Master bawareca's Avatar
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    In Europe it is a known fact VW (VAG AG) are cheaters. As I said before, everything goes back to Ferdinand Piech's dreams for world dominance. But this time they got way over their heads. If this wasnt a corporate policy they wouldnt get so deep in the sh!t.
    This is not good for the auto business at all and for diesels in particular. I dont think other [German] manufacturers would've exposed VW even if they knew. Toyota probably would, in a heartbeat.

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    Quote Originally Posted by bawareca View Post
    I guess you will get some money back at some point, or they will offer you to buy it back. But the feeling that "someone" tricked you into buying a car that is not what it was advertised stays for a while
    I think this will get ugly! I betcha' VAG's $7.3 billion their putting aside equals the total buyback amount (at today's rates) of all those diesels, world-wide!

  10. #30
    Senior Member bikeindirt's Avatar
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    My money is on every car maker does something similar... look at the companies that are significantly better hp/mileage... or lots of power.

    When driving an EV, I can "smell" other cars, like riding a bike... On a freeway on ramp, some of the newer cars have that early 80's exhaust smell... The new mustang smells like the 70's...

    and VW stock is down again today... time to buy?

    BID
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  11. #31
    Senior Member bellwilliam's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by bellwilliam View Post

    this might not be over yet. may be European and/or Asian TDI had the same thing ?
    Bomb just went off in this story

    Quoting myself !!!
    http://mobile.nytimes.com/2015/09/23...-scandal.html?

    VW now says 11 million cars are affected. US number is only 1/2 million cars. This just blew up 20 times bigger

    I am not sure how they gonna dig themselves out of this one. There will be a movie made about this.
    Last edited by bellwilliam; 09-22-2015 at 08:30 AM.
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  12. #32
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    Maybe I will get a big enough pay off for my Passat to buy a Tesla (and replant Oli's lawn)

    SCORE!

    craZee
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  13. #33
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    In my best Soup Nazi voice - 'No Red Bull for you VW'.

    11M cars. Yowza. VW will be very lucky to survive this.
    Last edited by markn; 09-22-2015 at 08:27 AM.
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  14. #34
    Senior Member robburgoon's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by bikeindirt View Post
    My money is on every car maker does something similar... look at the companies that are significantly better hp/mileage... or lots of power.

    When driving an EV, I can "smell" other cars, like riding a bike... On a freeway on ramp, some of the newer cars have that early 80's exhaust smell... The new mustang smells like the 70's...


    BID
    That would make sense. Can't set another maker on fire if your own house isn't in order.

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    Uh oh! to add insult to injury, it's looking like CEO Winterkorn's (Company C.E.O. during this scandal) contract will not be renewed. They're talking about Porsche CEO, Matthias Mueller taking the reigns.

    Winterkorn fought with Piech for years on entering F1, Piech is gone, and he was finally going to get his wish and now this scandal and Porsches' ego are going to get in the way.

    I really hope (although don't expect) Huber (intern Chairman) pushes through Audi's move to F1.

  16. #36
    Senior Member bellwilliam's Avatar
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    I bet Porsche isn't going to F1. I have a feeling either Audi or Porsche will get out of WEC. Budget gonna be cut to survive this thing.

    You know what the penalty is when we are caught without a catalic converter ? This is such a deliberate F U to EPA and CARB. They are not getting out of this one
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  17. #37
    Senior Member bikeindirt's Avatar
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    If you thought the EPA was going to hit VW,,, Watch what the Euro's do to them... the French will lose their minds.

    My question is what happens when the environmentalists realize all cars are built to "pass the test"... even their beloved Prius.

    BID

  18. #38
    Senior Member Silversprint's Avatar
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    They will need all their profits to get through this. Their near future profits are going to tank because they will stop selling all diesel cars until they are fix. That's a huge hit, specially in Europe.

    No way they are going into F1 now.
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  19. #39
    Senior Member bikeindirt's Avatar
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    My guess is this is not a diesel only problem... and for sure it's not a VW only problem,,,

    You think every car maker is going to have to pay billions in fines? seems hard to imagine,,,

    BID

  20. #40
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    My friends bought a New Beetle convertible TDI the day before this story broke . . . ouch.

    Quote Originally Posted by bikeindirt View Post
    and VW stock is down again today... time to buy?

    BID
    I was thinking the same thing about buying stock in VW but I don't think the bleeding will be over anytime soon.
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