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Thread: SoCal SuperMiata thread

  1. #401
    Senior Member comradefks's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by emilio700 View Post
    Keep making it steeper until your car starts to understeer or you can't keep up with the other guys in your class on the long straights.
    That is all there is to it. Don't over think it
    Thought I had it up pretty much as high as I could put it. Somewhere around 50 degrees. Car still oversteered but that's par for the course with my setup. I backed it down to about 35-40 degrees later on the 2nd day and ran faster, guess that was the straightline speed tradeoff working.

    Will see how it works at Chuckwalla next, that should be a good test.

  2. #402
    http://www.trackhq.com/Banners/yellowsitesponsor.gif emilio700's Avatar
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    Default Junior update

    Update:

    Engine in, waiting for our first batch of our new lightweight aluminum flywheels.
    Most of electronics in
    -Megasquirt 1 Pnp
    -Racepak G2X
    -Racepak USM to display OEM fuel level sensor on G2X
    -Longacre smart gauges (stepper motors) with programmable warning lights. OP/OT/WT
    -Innovate wideband and analog gauge
    -Vertex 354 5w radio and in car harness with PTT on wheel
    -Longacre 75amp master kill switch (shuts off alternator too)
    -defroster and wipers deleted. Rain-X!

    Spa 5L mechanical fire bottle from weekend-racer.com (thanks John!) with extra pull near pax door
    FRP hard top skin from Alex Renderos. Light! Contact him through the SPM FB group if you want one.

    Wrap looks ok in pictures but is beyond horrible in person. Will get a cheapie paint job locally. Guess what color.
    It's a budget build so we're repairing and reusing good stuff off the shelves that we never got around to using before.
    All safety equipment is current. The Cobra seat is from Crusher so it only has 1.5 years left on FIA stamp before it needs a recert, for example.

    Keeping the 1.6 and running it on E85 in hopes of getting close to 140whp. I doubt we'll get that much out of it so the plan is to drop comp weight if it's close to 140whp. If it's nowhere near 140whp, we'll swap in a new stock NB1 engine instead of pulling more weight. No amount of weight reduction can make up for hp/vs frontal area on the bigger track against the 140whp NB engines.

    Hoping to race it at Chuckwalla March 22-23. Super will be available to rent for that event (contact me offline) or you can make an offer for Junior as it's for sale now.


    1609648_10152162172017696_1922884637_n.jpg
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    SuperMiata

    Aside from their cost I never understood why people race them.
    But obviously I just dont get it. -fatbillybob

  3. #403
    Senior Member robburgoon's Avatar
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    Does the fuel gauge value display under one of the custom pages on the G2X? Or does it only log it? What does it show for the fuel level? Gallons? Ohms? Volts?

  4. #404
    Señor Member b3d3g1's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by robburgoon View Post
    Does the fuel gauge value display under one of the custom pages on the G2X? Or does it only log it? What does it show for the fuel level? Gallons? Ohms? Volts?
    There's a known resistance range for the fuel tank sender you can simply plug in to Racepak and get a 0-100% reading. Racepak also has an auto calibrate feature to read the sensor value at empty and then fill and read it at full and either say this is 100% or however many gallons you put in. Then you just set it to one of the pages.

    The fuel sender is just a variable resistor so you can setup the USM as a voltage divider circuit to calculate the resistance value. It also works a lot better when you use both the fuel sender leads coming out of the tank connector with the USM instead of just the single fuel sensor lead at the back of the OEM dash. You will read difference values with the car on or off with just the single wire measurement.
    -Anthony
    1991 Miata - Trogdor SuperMiata
    2011 Ram 2500 - all the torque
    2016 Kawasaki Versys 650LT - commuter
    2016 KTM 690 Duke - parked at the dealer

  5. #405
    http://www.trackhq.com/Banners/yellowsitesponsor.gif emilio700's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by robburgoon View Post
    Does the fuel gauge value display under one of the custom pages on the G2X? Or does it only log it? What does it show for the fuel level? Gallons? Ohms? Volts?
    gallons, one decimal. you can see the little black universal sensor module on top of the g2x box on the rear parcel shelf. That is what converts the sensor into A vnet signal for the display. my default is usually predictive on one side and RPM on the other. voltage is the other optional channel that I can toggle too.
    WWW.949RACING.COM
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    Aside from their cost I never understood why people race them.
    But obviously I just dont get it. -fatbillybob

  6. #406
    Senior Member comradefks's Avatar
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    Ok, starting my shopping list for the front SPM air dam. Are brake ducts required for NA with 1.8 brakes? I know at least one person...(cough, Anthony, cough) that had some brake overheating issues after the EP air dam install. Anthony does have 1.6 brakes to my knowledge so that might be more the issue.

    I'd like to not get the brake duct setup at this point but will if I'm going to overheat my brakes and ruin my fun at the track anyways. Thanks guys.

  7. #407
    The Real Captain Slow Red_5's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by comradefks View Post
    Ok, starting my shopping list for the front SPM air dam. Are brake ducts required for NA with 1.8 brakes? I know at least one person...(cough, Anthony, cough) that had some brake overheating issues after the EP air dam install. Anthony does have 1.6 brakes to my knowledge so that might be more the issue.

    I'd like to not get the brake duct setup at this point but will if I'm going to overheat my brakes and ruin my fun at the track anyways. Thanks guys.
    I'm a fan of brake ducts, I swear my pads last longer since I installed them. I don't think I've ever over heated pads before installing ducts but I've had ducts for years and I drive like a pansy.
    99 Mazda Miata SuperMiata #515 - AKA Sparky SOLD
    '91 Mariner Blue Miata project AKA Napoleon

  8. #408
    Senior Member comradefks's Avatar
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    In Anthony's case, it seemed he didn't have issues with the brakes until installing the EP air dam. Seems it cut down the airflow through the brakes significantly. Probably mostly from added the flat plywood underpanel.

  9. #409
    The Real Captain Slow Red_5's Avatar
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    My air dam isn't on yet but I intend to keep my brake ducts when the time comes. I don't have any real proof but I believe the cost of brake ducts will pay for themselves by extending the life of the front pads and rotors. Maybe I'm just fooling myself.
    Last edited by Red_5; 02-25-2014 at 10:38 AM.
    99 Mazda Miata SuperMiata #515 - AKA Sparky SOLD
    '91 Mariner Blue Miata project AKA Napoleon

  10. #410
    Señor Member b3d3g1's Avatar
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    I also installed the brake prop valve at the same time as the air dam and I wasn't adjusting it properly. I'm sure that and less airflow compounded the issue. Brakes are next on my list of upgrades and my air dam will be back on for Chuckwalla, assuming I make it.
    -Anthony
    1991 Miata - Trogdor SuperMiata
    2011 Ram 2500 - all the torque
    2016 Kawasaki Versys 650LT - commuter
    2016 KTM 690 Duke - parked at the dealer

  11. #411
    http://www.trackhq.com/Banners/yellowsitesponsor.gif emilio700's Avatar
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    Brake ducts are key. Good ducting almost doubles pad life. 2.5" works, 3" is best. 2" just doesn't flow enough CFM according to our testing.
    Aim duct exit at center of hub/rotor. Inlet should be as close to center as is practical with your set up. The air mass has more pressure there that it does out at the corners where the NB foglight ports are.
    Also, the air starts to move laterally across the front of the car out towards the edges so a NACA duct becomes more efficient that a round port with it's centerline 15° away from the centerline of the car and almost 90° to the actual airflow.

    On Super, we actually have our inlets facing laterally towards each other on opposite side of the radiator plenum. So, not pointed in the direction of travel but aimed squarely at the second highest point of pressure on the outside of the car (first is base of windshield).
    The plastic EP style air dam covers the whole nose with a smooth surface, mesh screen over the radiator intake plenum, just like #3.

    ALUMINUM FLANGES FOR DUCTING from Aircraft Spruce

    Option #1
    How Super is set up currently. Odd looking but very efficient and lower drag than #2 or #3

    1796955_10152177754777696_367544838_o.jpg

    Option #2
    Less efficient duct location but helped by quasi- NACA duct shape of the OEM NB2 airdam

    1921013_10152177766342696_2014889016_o.jpg

    Option #3
    Ducts near rad opening, closer to centerline of car where pressure is highest and not moving sideways yet = good.
    spm_action_banner.gif
    Last edited by emilio700; 02-25-2014 at 06:50 PM.
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    Aside from their cost I never understood why people race them.
    But obviously I just dont get it. -fatbillybob

  12. #412
    Sir flink
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    fwiw, I ran two events with the ducting and backing plate removed from one side of the car only. I'd come in hot and get a helper to measure the rotor temps with an IR thermometer.

    Result: ducted side was 10% cooler. 600F vs 660F (Sonoma), 700F vs 770F (Thunderhill). So not a huge difference, but significant.

  13. #413
    Senior Member comradefks's Avatar
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    Thanks for the info Emilio, saw that setup on Super at SOW. Very interesting and looks relatively straight forward to fab. Do you use the Trackspeed backing plates at the rotor? Also, any reason to have the bottom side of the bumper on the car with the air dam installed? Doesn't really serve much of a purpose at that point right?

    flink: Is temperature the only factor with pad wear? Did you see a difference in pad wear rate in your testing?

  14. #414
    http://www.trackhq.com/Banners/yellowsitesponsor.gif emilio700's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by flink View Post
    fwiw, I ran two events with the ducting and backing plate removed from one side of the car only. I'd come in hot and get a helper to measure the rotor temps with an IR thermometer.

    Result: ducted side was 10% cooler. 600F vs 660F (Sonoma), 700F vs 770F (Thunderhill). So not a huge difference, but significant.
    What kind of car and brake system?
    WWW.949RACING.COM
    SuperMiata

    Aside from their cost I never understood why people race them.
    But obviously I just dont get it. -fatbillybob

  15. #415
    Sir flink
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    Quote Originally Posted by emilio700 View Post
    What kind of car and brake system?
    240hp 2700lb e36. 13" 2-piece curved-vane rotors, wilwood 6-pots, 3" ducts.

  16. #416
    Senior Member comradefks's Avatar
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    Also, any way to use something like the Air Spruce flange on the OEM dust shield side? Cut a hole, rivet on the flange, connect the brake duct. Might not be enough room to fit the flange though, would have to measure.

  17. #417
    http://www.trackhq.com/Banners/yellowsitesponsor.gif emilio700's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by flink View Post
    240hp 2700lb e36. 13" 2-piece curved-vane rotors, wilwood 6-pots, 3" ducts.
    Useful data point for E36 owners. The Miata doesn't have such good airflow over the brakes. 2300# with 10.0 or 10.6" straight vane, OEM calipers for the subject of this thread.

    Ducts almost double pad life in race conditions on our little hairdresser cars. It's more like 1400° peak to 1100° peak with ducting for us.
    WWW.949RACING.COM
    SuperMiata

    Aside from their cost I never understood why people race them.
    But obviously I just dont get it. -fatbillybob

  18. #418
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    Quote Originally Posted by comradefks View Post
    Do you use the Trackspeed backing plates at the rotor?
    FYI. The Trackspeed plates are setup for 2" ducting... which is what I'm running.
    Haven't had a chance to measure the temp differences yet.

  19. #419
    Señor Member b3d3g1's Avatar
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    12808527794_bcedd952af_c.jpg

    Here's how I did mine. Granted this is my first attempt at aero stuff, but I think it turned out alright. I can get it on my trailer and I just have to install the ABS sheet with 8 or 9 bolts when I get to the track. Brake ducts and wire mesh stay on the car.
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    -Anthony
    1991 Miata - Trogdor SuperMiata
    2011 Ram 2500 - all the torque
    2016 Kawasaki Versys 650LT - commuter
    2016 KTM 690 Duke - parked at the dealer

  20. #420
    http://www.trackhq.com/Banners/yellowsitesponsor.gif emilio700's Avatar
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    That is a pretty tight radius 120* bend. I would suggest cutting a similar hole in the mouth of the bumper skin and rerouting. We did some crude testing at the shop with 2" and it only flows a useful amount of air if its pretty much straight. 2 5 is borderline with two 45* bends. 3" is awesome but, a ***** to fit around the shock and spindle.
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    SuperMiata

    Aside from their cost I never understood why people race them.
    But obviously I just dont get it. -fatbillybob

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